DUST Search - Calamari scout's precision is OP

OP FOTM wrote:

well at least you agree that you need to be nerfed in SOME form

I guess you are right. I am just not very confident that I will enjoy using the Minja if I skill into it because EVERYONE is using FOTM Calamari and will not even allow me to sneak anywhere near the hack panel I'm supposed to hack.

I just wish they would buff the Minja a little more than a PG increase. I think it deserves another low slot at the very least. Otherwise I don't think it's a wise decision for me to skill into it.

Plus, shotgun is basically an easier version of nova knives and is tactically superior, and I'm not a huge fan of how I'll have to skill into a CR which I have developed a loathing for.

I've never had one point into scouts (except my alts). I was a Minmatar Logi before 1.8 respec and ever since I started this game I wanted to be a fast hacker. But I'm starting to feel like I might as well not even bother because at least the Logi was bulkier and could wait until the objective was clear of hostiles to hack. Minja has to attempt to sneak right under the enemy's nose undetected, and while it's amazing when they pull it off, without team support that hack isn't even going to get through.


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Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone Psychotic Alliance 1396	Posted - 2014.06.25 07:58:00 - [1] - Quote Let me get this straight. CalScouts are op because they are good at scouting? Calmanndo user with nova knives: Because someone has to do it.
Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone Psychotic Alliance 1396	Posted - 2014.06.25 08:39:00 - [2] - Quote OP FOTM wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Let me get this straight. CalScouts are op because they are good at scouting? Edit: TL;DR calscouts are op because you don't have to be a good scout to be good at scouting no, because the Minja and Amarr has to tie one arm behind its back just to anywhere close to a Calamari. You're saying you should be able to camp hack panels and deny the Minja the ability to do what it's designed to do - speed hack? Fit three complex precisions on your Calamari and the goddamn Amarr would do a better job of stealth hacking because the only thing that could avoid scans is a Gallente or an Amarr with 4 complex damps. that's like saying "oh, let's add Amarr and Minmatar tanks to the game, but make them constantly be scanned by Gunnlogis so if there's a Gunnlogi on the field it can instantly camp you without having to make any effort at all" Get real. Your Calamari is broken and needs fixing. So your upset that the scout suit designed to be good at scanning, is good at scanning? And the suits that aren't designed to avoid detection, aren't very good at avoiding detection? Calmanndo user with nova knives: Because someone has to do it.
Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone Psychotic Alliance 1397	Posted - 2014.06.25 08:57:00 - [3] - Quote OP FOTM wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: So your upset that the scout suit designed to be good at scanning, is good at scanning? And the suits that aren't designed to avoid detection, aren't very good at avoiding detection? All you need is one Cal in every squad in a Planetary Conquest to completely dominate all the other scouts, not to mention the poor mediums and heavies who will be constantly scanned. Your Caldari scout is a super weapon. There are no flaws to it, no weaknesses because laser weapons that can melt through you can't even get close enough because their optimal range is within your 70 meter scan radius. What is the Cal scout designed to be bad at? Scanning Gallente scouts? So you're trying to tell me that it's BALANCED that only ONE suit in this entire game can counter a Caldari scout? That's what made tank spam OP before they fixed it. Only forge gunners could counter tanks, and while they are trying to do so, the entire enemy team sees them and is focused on killing them because they know it's their achilles heel. Squads with Calamari in them can be invincible. What are you going to do, snipe the Caldari scout? You're not even going to SEE HIM. So there is no weapon capable of killing a calscout? Calmanndo user with nova knives: Because someone has to do it.
Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone Psychotic Alliance 1397	Posted - 2014.06.25 09:35:00 - [4] - Quote Very well then. So the suit designed to scan is op at scanning? Let's take a look at some stats. First, we'll assume max stats for everything. The base suit with max skills is 34.5. Last I checked, only the shotgun has an optimal of less than that. So were good here. Let's toss on a range amp. Now we are at 50m. Got about half the weapons scanned outside their optimal. Looking good. Toss on another range amp. You get 69.59m. That's some good distance. Of course, you now have 87 armor tops (remember, we are assuming max everything) so there is that. A ha, but we have shields! Huzzah, let the health come in, baby! So we toss on 4 complex extenders and get the massive total shield of... 452.5. Amazing, I know. Which gives us a grand total of... 540 HP. That's about 18 militia AR bullets, not counting extra shield damage. At 800rpm, we have the shields gone in... 1.35 seconds. My oh my, what a hard tank to break. Sentinels should be envious. But wait, there's more. All that shield means your scan precision is 27dB. Which means a scout suit, not counting Gallente, who have a bonus to dampening, can get under you with one complex damp, for the massive fitting cost of 33 CPU. Golly wilickers, who could possibly fit THAT? and 0pg usage? The Minny scout is hurting for pg already! So if we want to scan us some dampened scouts, we need to drop an extender for an enhancer. That brings us down to 380 shields, but we can scan them now! Looks like a militia rifle can remove our shields in a second, but whose keeping track? Sarcasm aside (I get dickish when I'm drunk, f*ck it right?) there is nothing wrong with the scanner scout being good at scanning. The problem is everyone else getting the scans of the scanner scout. Remove that, and about 90% of everyone complaining will disappear. And a calscout can indeed scan any suit down, save gallente scouts trying to avoid them. But a starter fit can also kill those calscouts in about 1.5 seconds, because they have literally no tank. So most everyone should have it easy killing them. The problem isn't the calscout being good at scanning (which again, its its freaking job) but that the people in slayer nonscanny suits are getting the benefit of the calscout scans and using this to now everyone down. Calmanndo user with nova knives: Because someone has to do it.
Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone Psychotic Alliance 1398	Posted - 2014.06.25 19:52:00 - [5] - Quote OP FOTM wrote: well at least you agree that you need to be nerfed in SOME form I guess you are right. I am just not very confident that I will enjoy using the Minja if I skill into it because EVERYONE is using FOTM Calamari and will not even allow me to sneak anywhere near the hack panel I'm supposed to hack. I just wish they would buff the Minja a little more than a PG increase. I think it deserves another low slot at the very least. Otherwise I don't think it's a wise decision for me to skill into it. Plus, shotgun is basically an easier version of nova knives and is tactically superior, and I'm not a huge fan of how I'll have to skill into a CR which I have developed a loathing for. I've never had one point into scouts (except my alts). I was a Minmatar Logi before 1.8 respec and ever since I started this game I wanted to be a fast hacker. But I'm starting to feel like I might as well not even bother because at least the Logi was bulkier and could wait until the objective was clear of hostiles to hack. Minja has to attempt to sneak right under the enemy's nose undetected, and while it's amazing when they pull it off, without team support that hack isn't even going to get through. Sober now. CalScout should see everything around him, up to 70m if he so decides to fit. But his squad should only receive such Intel if he gets a mic and tells them where they are. Don't blame the suit for being good at what its supposed to do. Blame the shared tacnet for letting everyone piggyback on his abilities. Also, Minny scouts don't need more pg. Shield extenders need to cost less pg, by about 3 less at proto. That'll free up a good amount of pg for them. Calmanndo user with nova knives: Because someone has to do it.
Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone Psychotic Alliance 1404	Posted - 2014.06.26 06:51:00 - [6] - Quote OP FOTM wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Also, Minny scouts don't need more pg. Shield extenders need to cost less pg, by about 3 less at proto. That'll free up a good amount of pg for them. Now you're just pissing me off. I just threw a proto fits with damage mods instead of shield extenders to humor you, because they have 2 less PG than extenders. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/0/5139 At the very least they need a bonus to fitting kin cats. The suit can barely fulfill its intended role using a LP store combat rifle, no grenade, and a basic cloak (which it's supposed to get a fitting bonus on). By the way, this is unrealistic because it takes into account things like the basic light weapon skill and fitting optimizations up to 5, so you actually can't even fit that much realistically. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/0/5140 This is the Calamari fulfilling its intended role. Note that every single slot is full and there's a PRO CLOAK and the RR isn't specialist. Stop rubbing salt in our wounds just because your OP suit needs to be nerfed. Remember the whining you did about being scanned? Drop a kincat or the cardiac, and toss on a dampener. I dropped a kincat. Now only a calscout or a proto scanner with gallogi bonus can find you. Which is fine, because only two suits can find you. The suits that are designed to find people. Funny how that works, huh? Now replace two of those myrofibils with shield extenders. Weird how that all fits with 4 pg to spare, huh? Now imagine if you had 6 pg freed up from less pg on shield extenders. That fit explains a lot of why you're bitching. You whine about how a suit designed for finding dampened suits is finding your undampened suit. What did you think was gonna happen? Calmanndo user with nova knives: Because someone has to do it.